This is far too restrictive a view of selflessness, and requires a stoicism that is nearly inhuman. I do not think we should laud someone for donating to charity without feeling good about the decision. In fact, I doubt seriously that praising anyone for experiencing no emotion is ever a good idea (which of course excludes me from several of the world's religions).
We must understand that selfishness is exclusive concern for oneself. It is doing something which is good for yourself without regard for its effect on others. It is not selfish to feel good about helping someone. Win-win situations are not selfish.
Many of my views on selfishness come from John Piper's well-known book, Desiring God. If you've never read it, I highly recommend the first chapter; the book is more repetitive than "99 Bottles of Beer," but that first chapter is excellent stuff. I don't agree with Piper on everything, but his views on selfishness, duty, and love are dead-on. Piper's central point is that it is not a sin to desire your own pleasure or good. God makes it quite clear in the Bible that he desires what is best for you, and there is no reason you shouldn't desire it too. And what's best for you is him. This desire should run through every aspect of Christian life, from prayer to evangelism to worship.
Piper goes on to present an analogy about buying flowers for his wife on their anniversary. He explains that if he takes no joy in this act, his wife won't appreciate it very much. Who wants to receive flowers with a card reading, "I present these flowers to you because it is my duty to do so?" No girl I've ever met. We want gifts to be given to us out of love, and love means taking joy in others' happiness. To call this selfish is just silly. And our attitude towards God should be similar. We act dutifully towards our spouse and our God because we love them—which greatly benefits us.
Of course this whole idea was presented long before Piper wrote his first word by ol' Jack Lewis, in the greatest sermon I've ever heard or read, The Weight of Glory. Back in 2005 I posted the first paragraph here, which provides Lewis' beautiful thesis: our problem is not that we desire too much, our problem is we desire too little. The notion that earnestly desiring our own good is a bad thing has no place in the Christian faith.
I suppose I'm a little unsure of your contention. Do you believe in selfishness for yourself? In marriage? In friendships?
ReplyDeleteI know we've had arguments similar to this over the years, and it seems like you may have changed. Are you over sacrifice? Are you on the selfish, capitalist trading side now?
I definitely haven't changed, I still believe there is such a thing as selfishness and it is not virtuous. I was trying to make the distinction here that selfishness requires you to care about your actions' effect on others, but does not require you to experience no benefit yourself. Therefore, win-win situations are not selfish. Stealing your neighbor's property is.
ReplyDeleteI know we don't agree about the nature of selfishness, but I really didn't intend to take on any of your beliefs in this post. I meant to start with the presupposition that selfishness is sinful, and work from there, precluding those who respectfully disagree.
I do consider myself on the capitalist side, though. ;)
I like your posts a lot!
ReplyDeleteI too believe God wants us to be happy. He is our loving father, after all!
He also wants us to be obedient, regardless of how we feel (honoring Him and the Commandments even when we don't 'feel' it) but I firmly believe happiness follows when we are in agreement with Him.
Thanks! I have to admit I have a hard time extending this to "happiness." I don't think God wants us to be happy all the time, or that our happiness is the result of our obedience to him. But I do believe he wants what is best for us.
ReplyDeleteWell, Justin, I'm not sure I agree and I'm having a hard time finding the words to make sense of this. You say that selfishness requires you to care about your actions' effect on others, but I'm going to disagree. I believe, that in order to be selfish, you care about your actions' effect on yourself.
ReplyDeleteAnd I definitely don't believe that win-win situations are not selfish. If Bryan and I agree to divide the chores, that is a win-win situation. I would do it even if I didn't care about Bryan because it works for me. But since I also care for Bryan, nothing really changes the fact that I did it to be selfish. The fact that he also benefits is just (for lack of a better word) "collateral damage."
I'll add to this discussion with a little quote from (I bet you could've guessed) Ayn Rand, in her introduction of The Virtue of Selfishness:
In popular usage, the word “selfishness” is a synonym of evil; the image it conjures is of a murderous brute who tramples over piles of corpses to achieve his own ends, who cares for no living being and pursues nothing but the gratification of the mindless whims of any immediate moment.
Yet the exact meaning and dictionary definition of the word “selfishness” is: concern with one’s own interests.
This concept does not include a moral evaluation; it does not tell us whether concern with one’s own interests is good or evil; nor does it tell us what constitutes man’s actual interests. It is the task of ethics to answer such questions.
----
That is my understanding of selfishness, said better than I could have.
Interesting discussion. I think everyone is selfish by nature, self interested in preserving our life. But when love stirs in us, love is caring for something, and if that is a someone, we may make decisions based on love for that person or love for our selves. I think you could split your chores with someone for selfish or selfless motives. And sometimes the motives don't matter. But to the one who gives out of love, they receive another reward - freedom to give and be free from the fear and selfishness of self preservation.
ReplyDeleteJustin,
ReplyDeleteAll I have the typing patience for (one handed at the moment) is to say that i finally read "The Weight of Glory" thanks to your post. It was beautiful. Thanks!
Alyssa -- I understand your disagreement and I respect it. I certainly did not mean to direct this post towards you, because we disagree about this topic on a fundamental level. This post was more directed towards those who believe selfishness is sin, and then erroneously conclude they should take no benefit or joy from any selfless act. Obviously I don't think you believe selfishness is sin (or evil, or wrong, or what have you) in the first place.
ReplyDeleteWithout getting too down in the weeds, the simplest thing I can say about Rand's quote is I think she's got the definition of selfishness wrong. From Merriam-Webster: "Selfish, adj: concerned excessively or exclusively with oneself; seeking or concentrating on one's own advantage, pleasure, or well-being without regard for others." [emphasis mine] By this definition, doing something for yourself (like splitting the chores with Brian) with no concern for its effect on him is selfish, while doing it to benefit both of you is not.
Anon -- That really gets to the heart of the matter, the nature of the reward—the contrast between the immediate award of a selfish act and the higher reward of a selfless act.
Evan -- You're welcome! That is the best I could hope for. I think every pastor/teacher should read it.
Interesting thoughts. Thanks for the clarification on your ideas.
ReplyDeleteAlso, Bryan is spelled with a y.
No problem! Interesting thoughts from you as well, thanks!
ReplyDeleteHaha indeed it is, I'm sorry.
Wait-- Erin just pointed out to me that I made a mistake in my first comment:
ReplyDelete"I was trying to make the distinction here that selfishness requires you to care about your actions' effect on others, but does not require you to experience no benefit yourself. Therefore, win-win situations are not selfish. Stealing your neighbor's property is."
That should be selflessness. I see now that's probably where a lot of your confusion came from. I'm really sorry!
This post and those who require stoicism to be selfless remind me also of a Christian teacher that once punished the A+ students for being "prideful". Probably the same people who believe that healthy eating never involves enjoying one's food. I wonder if we could find some instruction regarding convincing Christians to expunge the joy from their lives in the Screwtape Letters?
ReplyDeleteI don't remember any, but I read it so long ago. I should revisit it soon.
ReplyDelete